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Post by haitch on Jul 27, 2022 14:14:16 GMT 10
Does anyone know any more about left side swing arm drive spline movement. I understand the fit was inadequate allowing movement. Mine was checked during remap and pronounced OK. I am wondering what happens further down the road? Should it come loose.
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Post by Uralee on Jul 28, 2022 9:27:19 GMT 10
There are a number of ways to secure a bearing. Importantly, one should not “drive” the axle in or out as this may loosen the support bearing in the swingarm. A2’s bike obviously had a very tight axle judging by the hammer marks…..which possibly lead to the bearing coming loose in the swingarm. Mine was also extremely tight and I have subsequently fixed that and developed an extremely simple method of removing the axle…….given the number of bearings on the axle there can be a fair bit of friction to overcome.
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Post by haitch on Jul 28, 2022 18:00:43 GMT 10
There are a number of ways to secure a bearing. Importantly, one should not “drive” the axle in or out as this may loosen the support bearing in the swingarm. A2’s bike obviously had a very tight axle judging by the hammer marks…..which possibly lead to the bearing coming loose in the swingarm. Mine was also extremely tight and I have subsequently fixed that and developed an extremely simple method of removing the axle…….given the number of bearings on the axle there can be a fair bit of friction to overcome. Hi there Lee. I confess. I am not as familiar as you with the workings of the LHD drive. I do recall the additional effort required to remove your axle and the cunning pusher device you configured. I did follow those posts quite closely. So thank you for that. I wasn't aware of A2's issue and saw nothing on here about that one. Perhaps I just missed it. I recall you mentioning all the bearings and agree that there would be significant resistance to removing the axle should any corrosion manifest itself or a bend occur in the axle. I do recall you mentioned that the pusher device was not without its problems too. ie pulling the seal out. How was this resolved? In relation to my initial question. I am referring to the "Splined Sleeve" Item 11 on the swing arm diagram. This engages with the left end of the swing arm and is held captive by the axle nut and washer when assembled. It is supported by Item 6, ball bearing which is at home mounted on the sleeve, and against a shoulder on the swing arm and protected by seals item 5 and 10 on each side. I agree completely that the bearing integrity may be compromised should the spline get corroded or damaged in a way which would create difficulty in sliding them apart, in either assembly or removal of the axle. What I do not understand is how the "Splined Sleeve" can drift out toward the SC universal at all. But this is what is being tested at EB and resolved by including a circlip back toward that bearing somewhere for those cases where movement is detected. Hence my questions regarding what the future may be for this component. As I was advised to "Keep an Eye on it" Perhaps I got the discussion wrong?? I wish I had the diagrams there at the time. After consulting all the component drawings and LHD Final drive schematics I cannot for the life of me see how the "Splined Sleeve" can move crossways to the Sidecar Universal Yoke. Everything is sandwiched between locating pins at each end. What did I miss??
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Post by Uralee on Jul 28, 2022 21:22:13 GMT 10
Quote……I cannot for the life of me see how the "Splined Sleeve" can move crossways to the Sidecar Universal Yoke. Everything is sandwiched between locating pins at each end. What did I miss??
Aah grasshopper, to see….you must look not just with your eyes, but with experience. 😇
Simples…..the splined sleeve does NOT move out……the swing arm moves in. Look at the diagram…shoulder prevents the swingarm moving out….nothing preventing moving in other than bearing friction. You will be surprised how flexible the arm is. My pushing tool was working fine but was also able to flex the swing arm so I had a re think and moved to the other end of the axle……a threaded hole in the axle flange and a longish bolt provides simple removal and the same bolt (plus a nut)screwed into the flange securing thread provides a means of refitting without Ivan’s hammer. I also have relieved the inner square edge of the axle spline as I found after a few thousand km it would not feed back into the bearings as it had no lead, and I am definitely not using Ivan’s hammer.
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Post by haitch on Jul 28, 2022 22:48:38 GMT 10
Thank you Master. Many questions, so few answers. Grasshopper is hopeful of better information from the "Tower on Hill" So,it is now swing arm inward flex being dependant on how good the interference fit between bearing/swing arm and splined sleeve? Same question Master. Will sleeve need circlip to contain flex for future?? I only hear silence from "Tower". It will serve new "grasshoppers" to understand and pay close attention. If they can bear sitting through this🤣🤣🤣😎😎 I note there is another bearing carrier right up against the splined sleeve. This is associated with the backing plate. Does this move inward too?? Thanks for the tip on the spline too, Master Lee.
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Post by Uralee on Jul 29, 2022 8:54:25 GMT 10
I do not see an issue provided I am right in thinking the cause is the method of removing and fitting the axle. H, it would take 3 foolscap pages to explain my thoughts completely and I would probably lose you on the way. When we catch up we can have the discussion with the aid of the diagram.
I have not pulled the seal to see if there is a circlip groove but if there is, I would probably fit a circlip.
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Post by haitch on Jul 29, 2022 12:33:06 GMT 10
I do not see an issue provided I am right in thinking the cause is the method of removing and fitting the axle. H, it would take 3 foolscap pages to explain my thoughts completely and I would probably lose you on the way. When we catch up we can have the discussion with the aid of the diagram. I have not pulled the seal to see if there is a circlip groove but if there is, I would probably fit a circlip. Lee. There is no circlip groove. I was handed one of the offending Items and advised where EB cuts the circlip groove. I think I understand where your thinking is. The issue is the degree of interference fit on both bearing OD and ID. It only takes one to loose its interference. That then allows the Swing arm to flex inwards, taking the seal lip with it. On the matter of axle fitting/removal and providing the spline is in good order, there should be little resistance at the swing arm bearing. Axle fit to all those bearings should not be an interference fit. Perhaps transition fit. I also note that if the flange at the FD end is not machined square with the axle centre-line there will be significant issues with axle fit. Overall, I think the design needs some work to improve these niggles. Plus I think some acknowledgement by Ural HQ, would go a long way to ease some anxiety regarding this event coming about sometime in the future. In plain speak, will a future event be covered if perchance it occurs outside of warranty. It is after-all a known problem and the opportunity exists to fix it, before maintenance is required.
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Post by Uralee on Jul 29, 2022 13:47:55 GMT 10
No need to be anxious about it……it is a simple fix if necessary and there are a couple of other ways to do it without cutting a circlip groove on the inner end of drive coupling. I can’t speak for URAL of course, other than to say from 55 years of dealing with automotive warranty from both sides of the counter, URAL is by far the most helpful of all. 👏👏👏👏
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Post by haitch on Jul 29, 2022 14:28:09 GMT 10
No need to be anxious about it……it is a simple fix if necessary and there are a couple of other ways to do it without cutting a circlip groove on the inner end of drive coupling. I can’t speak for URAL of course, other than to say from 55 years of dealing with automotive warranty from both sides of the counter, URAL is by far the most helpful of all. 👏👏👏👏 I don't have your experience, confidence or trust in any Automotive Group. But that's just me. If the fix is a simple one, as you suggest, why isn't Ural fixing it. Rather than waiting till it breaks, perhaps/maybe. If there is a simple way to mitigate against this occurring, then "grasshopper" is interested. Illuminate me please.
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bewildered
Tool for reverse shift lever removal
Posts: 276
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Post by bewildered on Jul 29, 2022 16:02:51 GMT 10
I too am only partially illuminated ! Perhaps a Loctite product ?
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